New to biking! Bike not starting!

[seanoconnell87]

Hey guys,

Just picked up my 1st bike a few weeks ago (attached) and just getting around to sorting out a few things now. Bike was starting and running fine when I got it, had a mechanic check it out at the time too and he gave it the all clear with the exception of a few bits and pieces (fork seals, chain/sprockets).

It's been outside about 2 weeks now and doesn't want to turn over. I've the choke fully on, and I'm not opening the throttle any amount. Battery is new, but has run down after my repeated attempts to start it. Trying in bursts of about 5-10 seconds of pressing start button, with breaks of about 30 seconds in between if this matters. When I got it 1st, it would start after maybe 3 or 4 turns and would rough idle for a small while before leveling out.

Would I be right in assuming the carbs might need a clean? Been reading this forum before I picked up the bike and there always seems to be great advice given, so hopefully someone can help.

Cheers guys,
Sean   

[sogon78]

I think the issue that your having is exactly like mine.

[clarkdw]

Would I be right in assuming the carbs might need a clean? .  

For sure you are right. Reading old posts you will find that most new owners go through the same scenario. It would be best if you can or are willing to learn how to do it yourself because the first cleaning is almost never the end of the story. It usually requires up to three or four cleanings before the bike will run to your satisfaction. The passages in the pilot jets are so small that the tiniest piece of dirt will clog them. The CB-1 requires a very, very strong battery to get it to fire. If you can, boost it from a car battery and check the exhaust pipes at idle when it starts. If you do not have four hot pipes at first start, then the jets are clogged.

[ceebee2]

Have you checked if stop switch on right hand switch cluster is on?
Or if when you last ran engine if fuel was very near reserve level some fuel may have evaporated and you need to put tap on reserve

[seanoconnell87]

For sure you are right. Reading old posts you will find that most new owners go through the same scenario. It would be best if you can or are willing to learn how to do it yourself because the first cleaning is almost never the end of the story. It usually requires up to three or four cleanings before the bike will run to your satisfaction. The passages in the pilot jets are so small that the tiniest piece of dirt will clog them. The CB-1 requires a very, very strong battery to get it to fire. If you can, boost it from a car battery and check the exhaust pipes at idle when it starts. If you do not have four hot pipes at first start, then the jets are clogged.

Cheers Mick. On reading advice from here, I tried boosting it from a car battery (fully charged battery, not attached to car) which gave the start a stronger kick, but still no turn. I'm comfortable working on basic car maintenance (brakes, servicing etc.) so would cleaning the carbs be doable with no experience with bikes? I have the service manual, but is there a good clear set of instructions anywhere? Maybe with pictures to fool proof it  Any special tools required?

Have you checked if stop switch on right hand switch cluster is on?
Or if when you last ran engine if fuel was very near reserve level some fuel may have evaporated and you need to put tap on reserve

Checked the stop switch and all ok. Fuel was near reserve, but I added about 5L a few days ago. Would swithcing to reserve make any difference?

It crossed my mind that it might have been dirty petrol, but same petrol was used in car and all fine there. Came from a different petrol carrier though so may have been dirt at the bottom maybe.

Cheers for the suggestions so far guys, I'm willing to try anything you think it might be. 

[greenstiles]

Hi Sean,

I just did mine to good effect. If you do have a cold down pipe, worth checking your HT leads too, as 1 of mine fell off when i touched it !!! someone had just pushed the leads into the caps (got to wind them on) or swap your plugs round and if you still have a cold pipe and your idle is rough, do the carbs.

Drain your carbs first, (BUT when re-assembling, pour some fuel down the main fuel inlet to put some back in there) also watch out for electrical connectors coming apart by the sub air filter..........and don't forget to reconnect the 2 breather hoses under the air box.

I have done many things on many bikes but had not opened a carb up for nearly 30 years ! on a Yam FS1E, so 4 carbs were a bit daunting, but on this bike i found that you can get away with leaving the throttle cables where there are and tip the carbs over, rest them on wood n rags, and do the job like that, ONE THING, undo the clamps closest to the engine (not the clamps that hold rubbers to carbs) and pull VERY firmly slightly rocking back and forth.

Feel free to ask me any questions as it's still very fresh in my mind , i even enjoyed it, bike ticks over like a dream now 

[seanoconnell87]

Hi Sean,

I just did mine to good effect. If you do have a cold down pipe, worth checking your HT leads too, as 1 of mine fell off when i touched it !!! someone had just pushed the leads into the caps (got to wind them on) or swap your plugs round and if you still have a cold pipe and your idle is rough, do the carbs.

Drain your carbs first, (BUT when re-assembling, pour some fuel down the main fuel inlet to put some back in there) also watch out for electrical connectors coming apart by the sub air filter..........and don't forget to reconnect the 2 breather hoses under the air box.

I have done many things on many bikes but had not opened a carb up for nearly 30 years ! on a Yam FS1E, so 4 carbs were a bit daunting, but on this bike i found that you can get away with leaving the throttle cables where there are and tip the carbs over, rest them on wood n rags, and do the job like that, ONE THING, undo the clamps closest to the engine (not the clamps that hold rubbers to carbs) and pull VERY firmly slightly rocking back and forth.

Feel free to ask me any questions as it's still very fresh in my mind , i even enjoyed it, bike ticks over like a dream now 

Ok, might need it dumb'd down a bit 

To check if I have a cold downpipe (I'm assuming these are the 4 pipes which lead to the exhaust right?), I'm guessing I'll need to get the bike started...? Is that right? That's a problem at the moment, even when boosting from a car battery.

The rest makes sense, but I wouldn't even know where to start, maybe until I took a look at it. Are there any special tools needed before I was to launch into it? Keep in mind, I'm not sure what I'm cleaning Any good instructions out there?

[schedMas]

 try checking the plugs and cables, there may not be current firing the plugs, if so might be ignition coil problem.  Remove each cable one at a time, use a screwdriver insert it in the cable plug while grounding it on the engine then crank it, if there are sparks that cable is good, then proceed checking all four cables. dont forget checking the plugs. if cables are ok, you might have fuel probs, start from the tank, put in new gas drain the old one, check the fuel valve make sure its not closed, check the fuel filter make sure its not clogged, check the fuel pump if it pumps fuel while on the crank, then if all is ok, go to the carbs, have it serviced so you wont have any hassles, or you can check on the net for some tips and procedures on servicing the carbs, try Draining the all 4 carbs, then restart while on the choke, you might have flooded the carbs after all those attempts, if you decide to do the servicing yourself make sure while taking them apart dont mix those parts and jets, put them in a labelled container or cup and make sure the parts goes back on the specific carb they were taken out from, boiling the parts in water is the best way in cleaning those jets, dry them out thoroughly, blow compressed air or use hairdryer, also use WD40 to shed of all the remaining water particles before in putting them back in.  Re install and start on the choke.

[greenstiles]

Hi Sean, if you are a real beginner all this is gonna be confusing, i'd try the spark plug connections 1st, but be very care which way you do this as it can be dangerous.

If i was you, just take caps of spark plugs , unwind rubber caps off the cables, rewind them back on, see it it starts, if not , try and find someone who is good with bikes to come and have a look and show you.

Don't know if you have a trailer, but if you can find a good cheap workshop, prob best let them sort it. We have a guy round here, who only charges £60 to do something like strip carbs, or check valves, and he is a trained Honda mechanic !

[seanoconnell87]

Thanks again for the input guys.

greenstiles - theres a workshop a few doors down, but he's pretty heavy on pricing. I found a guy who comes recommended at a good price, but he's a good drive away (about an hour). Was going to shoot out to him to restrict the bike, but would have been riding out rather than carrying the bike on a trailer. I've just recently moved to where I'm living now so no trailer here unfortunately.

schedMas - thanks for that, might have to just print out the service manual and dive into it. If I have flooded it, I'm guessing the carbs will stay flooded until drained, right? Is there an easy way to drain them, or is it a tough job? When I started getting frustrated, I opened the throttle once or twice so it might be the case.

[greenstiles]

it may not be flooded, it may still be something else, if you drain the carbs completly, it will be very hard to start, till fuel gets in there. I'm not 100% certain on this, but i have had trouble starting after draining carbs, perhaps someone can confirm this ..

[clarkdw]

it may not be flooded, it may still be something else, if you drain the carbs completly, it will be very hard to start, till fuel gets in there. I'm not 100% certain on this, but i have had trouble starting after draining carbs, perhaps someone can confirm this ..

You are correct. The only time the fuel pump is pumping is when the engine is turning with sparks being generated by the ign system so it takes a LOT of winding over on the starter before the carbs are filled.

You can get rid of the excess fuel if it is flooded by turning off the fuel petcock and then wind it over on the starter for a bit with NO choke and the throttle held wide open. Faster if you remove the sparkplugs and do it but that is much easier said than done.

If you are removing the sparkplug caps to check connections you should look in the end of the wire cap where the plug goes . there is a slot for a straight screwdriver up inside there. Undo it and out will come a little resistor. clean up the contact area of it and the inside of the cap where it fits with some emery cloth. Corrosion can cause the connection to go bad over time.

[21st Century Boy]

I may be a little late in on this one but i had a similar problem with my bike when i first got it.

Bearing in mind it had been layed up in a damp garage for 3 years, it would run for say 10-15 seconds after numerous attempts on the starter and then nothing.

Took the plugs out one at a time, attached the corresponding HT cap, made sure the plug end was earthed to the casing and cranked the starter.

I noticed a very weak and lazy spark even with a new battery on all plugs, so checked plug gaps (OK), checked HT leads (OK), checked reg/rec unit and found this -


A cooked unit and plug, now wether that happened before i got it or whilst i was trying it again - i don't know but there was no burning smell at all so I'm guessing it was why the previous owner stopped using it? 

Anyway, after getting hold of a new genuine Honda unit and a new plug i tried again - better but not quite right.

So plugs out again to check gaps etc, this time i re-gapped them a little closer than recommended at 0.5 - 0.6, popped them back in and hey bloody presto back to life!!

Just to satisfy my new found fix i stopped and started her several times - no bother at all......

It may not be your problem but always worth a quick glance........oh and if the plug is a bugger to come adrift from the unit it's because its melted inside and may need some persuasion with a flat blade screwdriver.

[seanoconnell87]

Not late at all actually  I've yet to find some time to take a look into it, but going to go out tonight for an hour or 2 and poke around. Picked up a battery charger yesterday and went to charge the battery, but there's a pretty persistent rubber strap directly over it. Is there a release latch anywhere, or is it just up to pulling the strap up and yanking the battery out?

Heading out now to try again cause' it was dark last night!

[rigwit]

Cranking from empty carbs till pump has filled bowls would take around 30 second's cranking.....obviously you do not do this in1 go, 5 sec bursts 20 -30sec rest , you'l also want Full choke on and flick open the throttle a slight amount while in the cranking(starting)burst, if you flood the engine smell the end of exhaust you will almost smell neat petrol, if flooded best way for a beginner to do it, is remove plugs let engine sit overnight without them in, and the plugs can be dried off over a low gas ring and cleaned with a brass brush,check gaps 0,8mm Honda recommend, then fit them make sure caps are on plugs tight and correctly and then try a re-start sequence.