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Author Topic: New bike a Republican? (aka my bike doesn't lean LEFT).  (Read 2159 times)
RVFRick
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« on: July 18, 2017, 03:16:14 AM »

SPOILER ALERT AND LINK TO NEW THREAD
The issue resolved on it's own but has since returned 8 months later. Since this thread went off topic toward the end I started a new one here http://www.hondacb1.org/forum/index.php/topic,5612.0.html

Okay wrench heads, I hope I came to the right place. It turns out my bike doesn't like to lean Left. Let me explain....

I just purchased a CB-1 with 10k miles. I am 3rd owner. Original owner was a dealer in NV and second owner bought for wife but she never rode it. He spiffed it up and sold it to me. Any ways it's cherry and I want to ride it.

During the sale we started the bike on the center stand. Seller also said the bike took a while to warm up. After 3-4 minutes of idling on choke at 3k rpm, he slide the choke off and kept the engine running. Maybe a little rough. I took it for a test ride. All was good enough so we closed the deal.

I went to start it today and found it a little difficult to get going  Sad

With choke on I have to work the throttle a little to keep the motor idling. It will idle steady for the most part.

Now imagine straddling the idling bike & holding it vertical. If I tilt the bike to the left say just 3-4 degrees from vertical (no handle bar turning so confident it is not cable binding) the rpms drop instantly. No lag. I can use the throttle to keep it running. Go vertical it recovers. Leaning to the right no problem.  Huh Hmm, who would have thought to start the bike on its side stand. Undecided To be fair, seller tuned it at 4,500' and I am at sea level.

Seller stated he rebuilt the carbs. Carb insulators are original and seller said he couldn't find replacements so reinstalled and used RTV to help "seal" them. Not ideal but not crazy.

Anyways, what should I look into? Is there to mix up carb parts?  i.e. on my NC35 carbs 1&3 and 2&4 have different bowls and emulsion tubes. If it is float bowl setting would that affect the RPMs so dramatically and immediately and why when only tilting to one side and not the other?

Any ideas or guidance would be much appreciated  Grin
« Last Edit: April 06, 2018, 01:40:26 AM by RVFRick » Logged

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a_morti
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« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2017, 04:26:05 AM »

Welcome to the fold! We definitely need pics of your -1 and the 35!

It may be worth checking his work on the carbs. If any seals weren't replaced (some are sure to be nla) then look to these guys: http://litetek.co/Carb_Kit_Honda_CB1_NC27.html
Tried and recommended.

I wouldn't want to trust slightly leaking boots. There are now some cheapy replicas on ebay, could be better.
Look at this on eBay  http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/232342370235
Not tried but worth a look.

The air screws may need tweaking. Should be 2.25 turns out at sea level i believe. Best check me in the manual though.

The idle seems quite high so a lot of guys set it lower. Should be 1300rpm +/-100, it won't be happy lower.

If he's rebuilt the carbs they may need balancing.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2017, 04:31:39 AM by a_morti » Logged

Cam Drive Gear Train Smiley
Paulbwatertownct
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« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2017, 06:48:14 AM »

I recently went through this process as well, got mine running good, let it sit for a few months, then wouldn't run right again. Ended up that the pilots are so small that they clog from sitting for even a short period of time due to the quality of gas.

The Chinese carb insulators that Morti pointed out should be installed as the originals will be rock hard and RTV is not a solution. The tabs are not a perfect fit but they work and will seal well. 

Most likely the pilots are clogged from sitting w ethanol gas. Clean them up or you can get the recommended 38 pilots and 108 mains from Sudco or Sirius Consolidated (S.C.I.). Stock are 35/105. FYI the carbs are the same as those used on the original Honda CBR600F1 Hurricane, 87-90.

Morti, thanks for the link to LiteTek, that site may come in handy as I start my CBR-F2 project.

What is everyone using for fuel stabilizator these day? Sea foam, Belray, Stabile, something else?? I've recently started using Belray but too soon to tell.
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In the garage now: 03 Aprilia RST, 01 Aprilia Falco, 89 NT650, 89 CB-1, 90 NSR250R-SP, 91 CBR600F2, 79 CX500B
RVFRick
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« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2017, 12:28:45 PM »

Thanks for the insight and quick replies. Yes, Litetek are good. I just rebuilt my NC35 carbs using the kit. Boy, was that quite the introduction into carb rebuilding for a newbie. Took me a loooong time but they are good to go (I think!) and learned tons. Have yet to install them to the bike as I have many other items to square off first. That bike sat improperly stored for 7 years with fuel in the tank before I bought it.

I got the CB-1 to put around on but seems I may have another project  Angry

Now that I understand carb design (at least what the bits inside are) I can't explain why leaning a bike to the side would affect idle. It's a day and night response. How would tilting affect float action? Floats set too high so tilting makes it shut off the float valve? If so, would you expect idle response to be so direct and immediate? I would expect some delay.


* RVF400 128k size.jpg (74.42 KB, 556x376 - viewed 101 times.)
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RVFRick
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« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2017, 12:40:02 PM »

Photos of my new CB-1. BTW is there a way to post higher resolution photos? I've downsized to 75kb(!) and I have problems posting. A passive auto-resizing app would be handy.


* 2017-07-07 12.46.40.jpg (39.22 KB, 640x480 - viewed 101 times.)
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RVFRick
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« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2017, 12:40:37 PM »

Right side


* 2017-07-07 12.26.50.jpg (80.95 KB, 640x480 - viewed 108 times.)
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RVFRick
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« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2017, 12:41:12 PM »

left side.

EDIT
That's the seller in the photo BTW not me Wink
Seller drove 5 hours one way to deliver it. Nice!


* 2017-07-07 12.26.27.jpg (79.23 KB, 640x480 - viewed 101 times.)
« Last Edit: July 18, 2017, 05:38:53 PM by RVFRick » Logged

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RVFRick
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« Reply #7 on: July 18, 2017, 12:42:10 PM »

Speedometer/odometer


* 2017-07-07 12.47.00.jpg (52 KB, 640x480 - viewed 104 times.)
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RVFRick
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« Reply #8 on: July 18, 2017, 12:46:14 PM »

I'm getting the hang of posting photos


* 2017-07-07 12.46.51.jpg (68.15 KB, 640x480 - viewed 102 times.)
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VintageHunter
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« Reply #9 on: July 18, 2017, 02:49:20 PM »

question:
why is the title of the thread "New bike a Republican?"......I'm a bit confused.
Can the OP elaborate on this a bit?


Disregard the question...."doesn't like to lean left".........I get it now.

« Last Edit: July 18, 2017, 02:51:56 PM by VintageHunter » Logged

ModerateFkr
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« Reply #10 on: July 18, 2017, 04:14:58 PM »

RVFRick, please forgive me but I've smiled all the way through your first posts here. No malice intended of course, but either your (comic) timing is impeccable, or you read the most recent posts where my new buddy VintageHunter and I are doing our best impression of a Bill Hicks skit in which I'm sure he will be please to know he's Jack Pallance Wink.

You've also convinced me not to paint my CB-1 red. In the UK red is associated with the left, as it is internationally, but even though mine is a Japanese model, I'm not taking any risks. Wink

My theory on your problem is that something that moves, or shouldn't move but is, is somehow cutting either the fuel or the power. Copper wire hardens and fatigues over time. But if something in one of the carbs is loose, that might be the problem. Is it running on all four cylinders properly? It won't be the fuel line. The float chambers hold several minutes of tickover fuel.

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RVFRick
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« Reply #11 on: July 18, 2017, 05:35:20 PM »

RVFRick, please forgive me but I've smiled all the way through your first posts here. No malice intended of course, but either your (comic) timing is impeccable, or you read the most recent posts where my new buddy VintageHunter and I are doing our best impression of a Bill Hicks skit in which I'm sure he will be please to know he's Jack Pallance Wink.

You've also convinced me not to paint my CB-1 red. In the UK red is associated with the left, as it is internationally, but even though mine is a Japanese model, I'm not taking any risks. Wink

My theory on your problem is that something that moves, or shouldn't move but is, is somehow cutting either the fuel or the power. Copper wire hardens and fatigues over time. But if something in one of the carbs is loose, that might be the problem. Is it running on all four cylinders properly? It won't be the fuel line. The float chambers hold several minutes of tickover fuel.



Gotta keep smiling when untangling a mess  Smiley

My bike is blue which reinforces my suspicions  Grin

The bike has only 10k miles so I doubt any sort of metal wire fatigue.

Tickover fuel, I like that term and your theory. Something moves and ever so slightly but is obvious.

Can't hurt for me to ask the previous owner.

I dread having to pull the tank and carbs after going thru that exercise on my other bike. I want to try all external treatments before resorting to surgery.

Do the CB-1's have CV carbs?
« Last Edit: July 18, 2017, 05:42:43 PM by RVFRick » Logged

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spacetiger
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« Reply #12 on: July 18, 2017, 05:49:31 PM »

Thanks for the insight and quick replies. Yes, Litetek are good. I just rebuilt my NC35 carbs using the kit. Boy, was that quite the introduction into carb rebuilding for a newbie. Took me a loooong time but they are good to go (I think!) and learned tons. Have yet to install them to the bike as I have many other items to square off first. That bike sat improperly stored for 7 years with fuel in the tank before I bought it.

I got the CB-1 to put around on but seems I may have another project  Angry

Now that I understand carb design (at least what the bits inside are) I can't explain why leaning a bike to the side would affect idle. It's a day and night response. How would tilting affect float action? Floats set too high so tilting makes it shut off the float valve? If so, would you expect idle response to be so direct and immediate? I would expect some delay.

RVFRRICK,

What are you using to post pics?
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VintageHunter
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« Reply #13 on: July 18, 2017, 05:50:40 PM »

I'd like to know too cause "photosuckit" is dead to me.
Let us know please.
Thanks for the insight and quick replies. Yes, Litetek are good. I just rebuilt my NC35 carbs using the kit. Boy, was that quite the introduction into carb rebuilding for a newbie. Took me a loooong time but they are good to go (I think!) and learned tons. Have yet to install them to the bike as I have many other items to square off first. That bike sat improperly stored for 7 years with fuel in the tank before I bought it.

I got the CB-1 to put around on but seems I may have another project  Angry

Now that I understand carb design (at least what the bits inside are) I can't explain why leaning a bike to the side would affect idle. It's a day and night response. How would tilting affect float action? Floats set too high so tilting makes it shut off the float valve? If so, would you expect idle response to be so direct and immediate? I would expect some delay.

RVFRRICK,

What are you using to post pics?
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RVFRick
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« Reply #14 on: July 18, 2017, 06:31:00 PM »

I document most of my work so I have lots of photos. Too many. Anyways, I organize by areas of interest and project. In each master folder I create a "Low-Res" folder.

You need a PC to do this (wish Mac could do it) for this "hack":
1 Select your photos for downsizing (you can multi-select as many as you want).

2 Right click > Send To > Mail recipient. This launches a dialogue window Attach files
.
3 Select picture size "Smaller" or whatever will create file size you desire. Experiment as your results may vary.

4 Select Attach (launches MS Office Outlook for me)

5 Select all the attachment files in the email that Outlook has started and Ctrl+X (cut to clipboard) or drag to the "Low Res folder" you should have already made.

6 Now go back to your forum post and select and attach the appropriate downsized photo you just created. Done.

BTW I haven't been able to post more than 1 photo at a time to this forum even though each image is under the imposed 128kb limit. It might add the size of all photos (dumb).
« Last Edit: July 18, 2017, 06:35:29 PM by RVFRick » Logged

You meet the nicest people on a Honda.
RVF400, CB-1, C70, C70, C70
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