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Author Topic: CB-1 Mk2 Project  (Read 1453 times)
Pod70
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« on: February 12, 2018, 10:31:36 AM »

Since the demise of Photobucket, there doesnít seem to be many people posting projects on the forum so I figured Iíd start this thread using Flickr to host the images & hopefully inspire a few of you to do the same.
Ok, so here is the latest project a CB-1 mk2. Although Iíve worked on a mk2 before, this is the first one Iíve owned, although it was never really planned for it to come into my possession. Back in the summer it was posted on the Facebook page and the owner was looking for some help getting it back on the road after a minor crash. The bike had gone down on its left hand side but what caused the damage was that it went under an oncoming vehicle which smashed the clutch cover. As he was fairly local I offered to pop over and help him make a list of parts needed that I should be able to supply from my own stash of bits.
As the parts list grew and the amount of work and money mounted up, he decided that it wasnít worth repairing and that he would sell it for parts. A deal was struck and the bike was wheeled into the back of the van and sat in the shed for quite a few months until I was finally able to get round to sitting it on the bench and looking at it. The plan was for it to be a little project over the Christmas break but life in general and my other bikes had other plansÖÖ
DSCF0774 by pod_70, on Flickr
DSCF0772 by pod_70, on Flickr
The plan is to go through the bike sorting out any issues and get it back on the road again. Itís only going to be a clean-up and repair rather than a full on restoration. Sure Iíve said this before about other projectsÖ.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2018, 10:35:54 AM by Pod70 » Logged
Pod70
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« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2018, 10:32:08 AM »

The first job was to get it on my homemade ABBAish stand through the front engine mounts to raise the front end (my ABBA stand is too wide for the bench). The plan is to start at the front and work my way back.
DSCF0777 by pod_70, on Flickr
Something that definitely needs to be replaced is this exhaust Ė it looks like something that should be fitted to the underside of a Nissan Micra, not the side of a bike. It doesnít look home made either as the headers arenít standard CB-1 so I have no idea where it could have come from. Fortunately I have a decent original exhaust to fit.
DSCF0776 by pod_70, on Flickr
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Pod70
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« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2018, 10:32:57 AM »

Hereís the main damage. It looks worse than it is and there is no play or obvious damage to end of the crank as a result. You can see the bent brake pedal which will also need to be replaced.
DSCF0775 by pod_70, on Flickr
The clutch cover was removed and binned and the sump dropped for cleaning and inspection of the bottom end of the engine. A replacement flywheel & woodruff key have been fitted and while I was there I pulled the clutch to check the condition of the plates (all good).
There was some discussion on the Facebook page about using the £10 Chinese gasket sets off Ebay etc. The previous owner had bought a set and gave them to me with the bike but here are some photos which should explain why I wonít be using them.
IMG_0504 by pod_70, on Flickr
IMG_0461 by pod_70, on Flickr

Aaron - I know that's an NC23 pickup cover but I haven't removed the CB-1 cover yet  Grin
« Last Edit: February 12, 2018, 10:45:01 AM by Pod70 » Logged
Pod70
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« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2018, 10:33:48 AM »

The Front brake was seized on solid so this was removed (eventually) and stripped for cleaning and rebuild. The pistons have come up fine with a clean & polish so I just need a new set of seals.
DSCF0778 by pod_70, on Flickr
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Spurlock
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« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2018, 10:48:21 AM »

Thanks for posting Pod70, I'll be interested to- follow along. So I assume you checked the end of the crankshaft for runout? That's a scary looking ding in the flywheel!

-Bill
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1975 Honda CB125S2, 1989 Honda NX250, 1989 Honda GB500, 1989 Honda CB-1
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« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2018, 12:08:10 PM »

Looks like a nice little winter project. I wish I had a garage like yours, I particularly like the look of the most important tool in the workshop, the kettle! I have to put up with this freezing weather if my bike goes wrong.

You'll have it ready for the spring then  Grin

Just out of curiosity, where do you buy your gaskets and stuff from?
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Efreeman55
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« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2018, 01:28:51 PM »

I'd be really concerned about the end of the crank being bent with that kind of damage to the case and alternator rotor.  I have a spare, low mileage engine I bought along with my CB1 and it also had been down with damage to the alternator cover case.  The damage isn't as bad as yours but it was enough to bend the end of the crank.  Definitely something to check.

Eric
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a_morti
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« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2018, 04:08:03 PM »

We all love a project, keep it coming!

I'm also interested in what differences there are between a type one and a type two. You're one of very few people with access to both at the same time and a good eye, so it'll be interesting to see what you find. I know about higher bars, different tank and corresponding single snorkel airbox, the stock type 2 silencer is a little longer, various bits with different/darker finishes. Is the seat the same? Did they modify the footrests to match higher bars (they do this on the SV650/S for example)? Shock is different, is it the same dimensions just with a gas canister, or longer?

I have convertibars on my bike now, they could get to pretty much the height of your bars, with longer cables. Be interested in how the bike feels once complete.

I suspect that exhaust was fairly bling once upon a time, the spring hooks certainly suggest that even if the missing springs don't. Looks JDM, probably fitted to the bike back in Japan. Is the silencer aluminium? I suspect it's better than Dad Morti's bike has on it, he might be interested.

The engine has lighter paint than would expect on a type 2, I suspect it was already changed once in its life. edit: could just be the light

I bought a set of gaskets off Graeme France. He has had a batch of replicas made. Price wasn't quite £10 but cheaper than Honda and you know if it's GF, it'll be fine.

You can use the nc23 ignition cover, assuming it's same as CBR600f1, just fit the single ignition pickup from the CB-1 with some suitable screws.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2018, 04:18:31 PM by a_morti » Logged

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Pod70
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« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2018, 05:28:18 AM »

Damage to the end of the crankshaft was my main concern too. I did fabricate a bracket out of angle iron to mount to the crankcase and then sat my dial gauge on that to measure any run-out. it seems to be fine but I forgot to take any photos. It seems to be ok but I won't really know for sure until I fire it up and it's under load. I'll re-jig it & get a photo done. If the worst comes to the worst, I have a few engines spare but most need rebuilding in one way or another.

Normally get my gaskets and a few other bits through Graeme France as like Aaron says, he may not be the cheapest, but you know that the parts will be good quality.

Filterman - I've waited years to get a garage like this sorted out. It's only a single but it has power & light although there are normally a few bikes in there so you have move things out and around to get jobs done. I seem to spend as much time moving stuff out of the way as I do working on the bikes. Unfortunately the 'kettle' is a fuel jug so wouldn't want to be drinking out of that  Cheesy

Aaron - I'll try and make notes of any differences but I think you've listed the main ones and it does look like this bike has been modified quite a bit over time so has probably lost some original bits along the way - look at the Chinese front master cylinder & levers for example. My 1st CB-1 came with the same canister type rear shock & even had a bracket mounted to the frame to take the canister.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2018, 05:32:11 AM by Pod70 » Logged
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« Reply #9 on: April 05, 2018, 08:50:38 AM »

Ok so this one got off to a bit of a false start and with the weather we had in February & March, I did struggle to build up the enthusiasm to head out into the garage. When I have been there, it was to work on other bikes.

Race season has approached pretty quickly so the NC23 race bike has taken priority and needed a replacement gearbox to solve the problems with jumping out of 5th. Unfortunately to get at the gearbox means stripping down the whole engine and you end up with this
DSCF0780 by pod_70, on Flickr

Interestingly enough, the gear clusters (and ratios) for the NC27 & NC23 are the same despite the 27 using a 17" wheel and the 23 an 18". The only difference between the engines is therefore the cylinder heads & carbs, a lightened clutch basket in the 23 and the water pumps (the 23 has additional take-offs for the oil cooler behind the oil filter which is missing on the NC27)

I took the NC23 for it's first test run at Lydden Hill 2 weekends ago and it seems to be running great. Not the best circuit for testing as it's only 1 mile long and you only really use 2nd, 3rd & 4th but the session the previous weekend at Snetteron was cancelled due to snow on the track!
« Last Edit: April 10, 2018, 07:38:46 AM by Pod70 » Logged
Dash
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« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2018, 02:24:12 AM »

Snow Cheesy

So annoying when the weather decides to be a d*ck
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Pod70
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« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2018, 07:37:46 AM »

I had nothing planned for the Easter break so now that the race bike is up and running, what better than to crack on with the NC27?
Well Friday was taken up with a few odd jobs on the NC23 and sorting out the van ready for it's service on Saturday (there were jobs that I knew the garage would contact me about to add as extras to the service, so I figured I'd do them myself to save a few pounds).

The Van came back from the service with an advisory on the brakes so needs new pads, front discs, rear shoes & rear slave cylinders are required. so these were duly ordered. My Dad also popped over for a visit so we went out for the day to the Royal Engineers Museum in Chatham and spent the day looking at tanks and other cool military stuff - well worth a visit if you're in the area.

Sunday - I finally made it into the garage and managed to pull the little 27 out of its corner  Cheesy The plan was to take apart the front end and so first off were the clip-ons. It would appear that Honda have borrowed these from another model (VFR750 perhaps?) and the lower locating lugs would foul the bolt for the top yokes so Honda have added an additional spacer

DSCF0785 by pod_70, on Flickr

The top yoke came off and the list of damaged parts slowly revealed itself:
Clocks (not enough remaining to bother photographing)
Headlight
Headlight Frame, Rubber Top Hats & Alloy Brackets
Choke Lever
Clutch Cable
Clutch Lever Mount
Grips (these were pretty grubby and worn anyway)

DSCF0786 by pod_70, on Flickr
« Last Edit: April 10, 2018, 08:51:38 AM by Pod70 » Logged
Pod70
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« Reply #12 on: April 10, 2018, 08:44:23 AM »

Next job was to remove the forks and check the stations with a straight edge. These have survived the crash and thankfully are straight so that's one less thing to worry about thankfully. I'll check the length against another pair of forks but at a guess, I'd say they are about 25mm longer than those on a mk1. the fork oil didn't look too bad but I'll drain & replace this while I've got the forks out.

The steering felt a bit notchy so I pulled the yokes out and found that the bottom bearing was past its best and there were notches in the outer race on the top race so these had to go and a new set has been ordered.

DSCF0783 by pod_70, on Flickr

Another casualty of the crash was the Ignition Barrel. A chunk has been taken out of the casing around the steering lock and it looks like someone has taken a screwdriver to the lock in the past.

DSCF0791 by pod_70, on Flickr

A quick rummage through the spares stash soon turned up a replacement Chinese lock. Unfortunately the Chinese lock has a 2 pin connector and a bullet connector on the fan motor feed rather than the 3 pin connector on the Honda lock so I'll have to modify the wiring to suit

DSCF0792 by pod_70, on Flickr

One of my pet hates is switchgear that moves around on the handlebars and for some reason, someone had cut the locating lug off of the L/H switchgear allowing it to rotate. I have no idea why they did this as the locating hole is in the clip-ons Angry

DSCF0788 by pod_70, on Flickr

I carefully drilled and tapped remains of the pin to take an M3 screw so that the head would now serve as the locating pin. The head is a little big bigger than the plastic pin so the hole in the clip-on was enlarged to suit

DSCF0789 by pod_70, on Flickr

Whilst I was there I gave the switches a good clean and blast of contact cleaner.

As there isn't much else I could do until the replacement head bearings arrive, I treated the forks & bottom yoke to a quick rub down, prime and few coats of black paint. They had been painted over in the past and were suffering from quite a few stone chips.

DSCF0793 by pod_70, on Flickr

All in all, not a bad days work

« Last Edit: April 10, 2018, 08:52:45 AM by Pod70 » Logged
Pod70
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« Reply #13 on: April 10, 2018, 09:02:30 AM »

Bank holiday Monday and as I was waiting on parts for the van, I was able to spend a few more hours on this. Obviously I couldn't do anything more with the front end so I moved back and set to on removing the airbox to reveal a rather grubby air filter element.

DSCF0796 by pod_70, on Flickr

Although these are fairly readily available through the likes of Wemoto, CMSNL & David Silver spares for around £25, I decided to employ the patented Amorti foam replacement method and whilst it's been documented before, I'm sure the accompanying photos have been lost to Photobucket, so here's the procedure:

1). Take a Stanley knife and cut out the paper element
2). Using the Stanley knife and some sandpaper clean up the opening and remove as much of the remains of the paper element as possible. You won't remove it all as it is moulded into the plastic.

DSCF0799 by pod_70, on Flickr

3). Cut a new element from a sheet of Filter foam. This needs to be a few mm bigger than the opening in the filter body so it can expand to fill any irregularities in the opening
4). Using some silicon gasket sealant, bond the short edges in place - this got a bit messier than I would have liked due to using an old tube of sealant but it's now not going anywhere.

DSCF0800 by pod_70, on Flickr

After that the carbs were stripped ready for a dip in the ultrasonic cleaner and a new set of O-rings courtesy of Blair at Litetek. A few other parts were removed and the next job is to check the valve clearances
« Last Edit: April 10, 2018, 11:13:05 AM by Pod70 » Logged
Pod70
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« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2018, 09:03:35 AM »

DSCF0803 by pod_70, on Flickr

Continued the stripping down until I got to this point to check the valve clearances - Amazingly they were all within tolerance and nothing further was required.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2018, 05:00:35 AM by Pod70 » Logged
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